Did new Atlantis exist?

We ask Keith Park, president of New Atlantis and author of fiction and non fiction books.

Q. Are there any ground to believe it existed.

Keith. Yes and no, there are mysterious circumstances that its existence could be used to explain.

Q. Like what?

Keith. When the Europeans first discovered the American continent there wee a number of items that could not be explained if there was up to then truly no contact between them.

Q. Can you define any of these?

Keith. sure, there was a lot of similarities between Mian and other old cultures and the Egyptians, Greeks etc, The pyramids in Mexico and Egypt are built using the same architectural principles, both sides of the Atlantic had colanders built on the same principles, developed the same decimal counting systems, had very similar mathematical systems, both values gold and the same other metals and both used them for jewelery.

Q. could that not just al be parallel developments that same from common basics ie sun, stars etc.

Keith. Yes, but their are other factors, the banana plant cannot be grown from seed, and is a plant native to Asia, that is found on the other side as well. In Peru there are ancient cave drawings of African Elephants that as far as we know never existed elsewhere. 

Q.  what about stories, legends etc, did they have any common elements between the civilizations.

Keith. We don't have a lot of records to do on, but we do find drawings both sides of the Atlantic of witches of similar design flying on broomsticks, and all these ancient civilizations as well as others have legends about a great deluge or flood that flooded everything and few survived.

Q. What about the written records about Atlantis.

Keith. Plato, in two dialogues, sort of radio plays or discussions with others, twice mentions Atlantis, firstly as a minor item, and then in far more detail. Just about everything written after that is based largely on this, It is said that there were Egyptian stories that are similar, but I haven't seen the detail of these.

Q. Could Plato just have made it all up, perhaps as a play.

A. Yes, but he was not an entertainer, he ran a very early form of university. I think it is reasonable to assume that he had been told the story, and he carries on an oral tradition of telling the story again.

Q. Such legends passed down through time, is there likely to be any truth in them generally.

A. most legends or stories handed down by one generation to the next and surviving over time, have a element of truth, but the story gets exaggerated over time.

Q. was this exaggerated. 

Keith. Well Plato talks of bridges 100ft wide, a cannel 300ft wide and 100 foot deep. 

Q. Do you see any problems with Plato's story. 

Keith. There are a few 'facts' that perhaps need thinking about such as the ring of cannels on a hill. As water never did run uphill, we either have a wet place where rain would keep these cannels toped up and an efficient lock system,  a means of pumping water, or some part of the story is wrong. 

Q. What do you think.

Keith. In Britain and elsewhere we have ancient hill forts with rings of ditches, sometimes tiered down a hillside. In some parts of these earth works water collects to form ponds or lakes. If you take a lower land example, Avebury, you find what was a steep sided, very deep trench, several times deeper than the trench as it remains today, which is still very impressive, that with the higher water table of the period would have probably had had water in it. Nearby is Silbery hill and in winter months we still see water all around its base. The cannels were probably defensive or ceremonial rather than for navigation or irrigation.

Q. What else is their against the concept of an extra continent in the Atlantic that has now disappeared.

Keith. Platonic theory. 

Q. Explain please?

Keith. It is said that all of our contents started as a single land mass, and split and moved away over time, and are still moving apart now. those who have played the jigsaw puzzle with the pieces can put it together without an additional continent, so unless this other continent was off the edge of the original land mass, It is difficult to see how it could have existed.

Q. Are there any explanations?

Keith, sure, it could have been part of an existing continent or given there limited navigation of the time, another island. If you sailed out from Gibralta (pillars or Hercules), into the Atlantis,  perhaps currents could move you further north, perhaps landing on Ireland or Britain, both continents for the man on foot, and both islands that could be sailed around. Or perhaps a larger version of the Silly Isles.

Q. Was there not also legends of another lost land somewhere off lands end. 

Keith. There are both Celtic stories from Britain and French legends of a lost Land. The various versions have a lot of common elements, including the deluge or flood.

Q. How large was this supposed to be.

Keith. That is not clear, there has and still continues erosion of the coast, and buildings are still slipping into the sea around the British coast. The English poet Tennyson reports of the lost kingdom of Lyonesse. Probably the earliest written record of a lost land is relatively recent in the 15th century the works of William or Worcester who reports woods and fields and 140 parish churches all now submerged, but this is clearly far later than the Atlantis story.

Q. If there any evidence remaining of anything.

Keith. William Camden reported the legends in 1602, and reported that around the seven stones half way between Cornwall and the isles of Silly, is an known as Tregua, which in Celtic meant a dwelling, and around these fisherman have brought up parts of doors and windows. Around the silly isles can be found what appears to be sunken walled field systems.  Some suggest these were some sort of fish trap or fish farm, as over recent history the water has not risen sufficient for this to be lost land from the legend of the period of King Arthur, Camelot, Lyonessse etc. Incidentally Lyonesse was supposed to have been connected to Cornwall so not an island kingdom.

Q. Are there any other legends relating to this.

Keith. Sort of, The is a legend of a sunken land with 16 greet cities off the west coast of Wales. The stories get a bit confusing as they also mention dykes holding back the sea, and some of these were said to be visible under the waters of Cardigan Bay. Again we don't know if it was supposed to have been separate or a part of Wales.

Q. Are there other legends of lost kingdoms.

Keith. Yes, Lemoria, but this seems to have been more an answer to a problem of animal and plant distribution than, legends. It was not really a single land mass but a number of land masses. There are quite a few maps about showing the ideas which came about after Darwins theories in the 1860's. the stories got quite wild from 15ft tall men to egg laying creatures becoming the first men there. Later scientific theories did away with the need for it.

Q. Any others of note?

Keith. There are also other recent reports of a lost island in the pacific called Mu. The first person to excavate the Mayan ruins in the Mexican state of Yucatan, was the Frenchman, Augustus Le Plongeon, (1826-1908) he also translated one of the few surviving Myan books, the Troana Codex, which gives an account of a continent of Mu, located in the Pacific Ocean, before being destroyed by an earthquake. He also suggested that they were the common ancestors of the Mayans, Egyptians and peoples of Polynasia.  Later in the 1920's and 30's a number of books were produced by the Anglo American James Churchward, who amongst other things created a map making Mu larger than the north American continent. He suggests it disappeared around 13,000 years ago.

Q. What about lost civilizations is their any evidence they existed.

Keith. You have numerous legends of lost lands and lost civilizations many very advanced for their time. Clearly there remains and more from many of these, and locations put forward for many of the stories. Clearly there was early civilizations who were quite advanced varying from this with field systems and more in Europe to ancient cities around the world.

Q. Are there any remains that are as old as the Atlantis story, and show an advanced society, and any that was proven to have been lost in a flood.

Keith. Yes, but not in the correct place. I suppose the most interesting is in what is now Pakistan. There were stories about of a lost civilization in the area, how Aryan invaders around 1,500bc destroyed over 90 forts and 100 castles. Up until the 20th century these were thought to me mythical. However In the 1920'sand 30's they were discovered and excavated. In 1944 Sir Mortimer wheeler, re excavated two major cities  and these were built between 2,500bc and 2,100bc. Although there was building in Egypt at the same period, these are different, for they show complete organized urban development, sewers, gutters, an organized street plan and more. the buildings are crated from fired bricks. One of these cities was built on a grid, with blocks, had 12 main streets varying form 30 to 45 ft wide, the blocks formed 12 areas 11, largely residential with closely packed houses, shops and workshops and the twelfth having a temple, granary complete with grain drying capability, assembly rooms, and great bath. Although there are the remains of many towns very little is known about their civilization and how it was run.

Q What does this have to do with floods.

Keith. It was built along the valley of the Indus river, and the whole area was below the water table and was regularly flooded. A lot of repair and rebuilding was necessary, and by 1900BC it was in decline, possibly because they had burnt all the wood in the area and could no longer fire more bricks. Where did they move to? no one knows. Clearly some stayed or others moved in and were later defeated. Much is still buried under the sands of the area. Although the worlds earliest town as we know it, very little has been done to find out about it.

Q. What else have you heard or read about Atlantis?

Keith. Have you got  a year spare. there are loads of theories of where it was ranging from platonic shift making it now the Antarctic , Bahamas, and a multitude of other places. Just about anything spotted in the Ocean anywhere, tends to be said to connected with Atlantis, and then you get the New Age religions, mystics and others, all who can tell you more than existing knowledge can help you with. You will find books that will tell you Atlantians came out of the ocean and others that they came from outer space. 

Q. Do you think Atlantis existed?

Keith. I don't know, most legends are based on something, there defiantly was ancient civilizations that have been lost and the sea has taken land and earth crust moved over the years. It can definitely not be ruled out. The question of course is not did it exist, but more about how was civilization organized and do we have anything to learn from them. Probably we will never know.